Topic: HC Post Deletion

[|BUG| Shamu]

Within the last hour a post by Hardcase was deleted by |Bug| Roamer.

The post quoted a PM allegedly sent by Roamer to RBG. Roamer deleted the post and has explained the reasoning to Hardcase via PM's.

Roamer can provide details should he wish.

His intent was to delete the PM commentary however the entire thread was deleted, including a response of mine.

I have spoken to Roamer about the deletion, circumstances and various options in handling posts that are an either false, vulgar or an invasion of privacy (read PM).

The circumstances are for Roamer's explanation and he has also been in PM contact with HC to resolve the issue.

I do not find fault with Roamers intent, only with his skills in working the various Forum controls available to him.

It is not and will not be the practice of the Buggars to delete or edit posts without explanations identifying who took the action.

Roamer has been so advised.

I also will not post one of my detailed responses I had prepared when I found the post deleted or try to recreate the one I had already posted.

I do want to say I found it reprehensible that a PM....Private Communication, was posted in Public Forum.

Not only that but posted by someone who did not receive the PM. So much for Private Messages. They are obviously not private in FS.

Private Messages, valid messages or not, are between two individuals. It's their issue to resolve.

Had the sanctity of PM's been respected by FS this situation never would have occurred and the issue could have been resolved between RBG and Roamer.

Public posting and sharing of Private Messages is a serious break of trust and lack of respect for privacy.

Not only that it appears the PM may not have even been valid, hence leading to the accidental total deletion.

Had the PM in question remained between the two individuals I believe this issue would have never happened and reached and amicable and informative resolution.

[[FS] Hardcase]

In response to Shamu,

I do not find the posting of someone sending hate email reprehensible.  I find it reprehensible that such stuff is sent. Erronously or not. It was settled quickly and amicably which was the original intention.

The post was not about 7, but about the lack of respect for people. Which was shown to 7 during her time at the FS and is now being directed at another person. It was sidetracked.

There was some sick individual out there posting garbage using Roamer's name. I just wanted to let the Buggars know what kind of stuff we all are continuing to get.

Roamer and I have communicated, I would have posted his reply in the proper forum if it was still there.  That is how it should be done. When I am wrong, I will admit it, when I act in haste, I will admit that also.

But I will alway fight against hate mail, public or private. I have alway believed in the pm's and emails for people to work out problems between themselves but just that.

Thanks again for the vent.

FS Hardcase

[|BUG| Shamu]

In response to Shamu,

I do not find the posting of someone sending hate email reprehensible.  I find it reprehensible that such stuff is sent. Erronously or not.

Understand HC that your original post was directed at Roamer with the assumption he had sent the PM. You made an assumption and cast an accusation without being informed.

It was sent to RBG, posted by you without you being fully informed.

I stand by my point that PM's should remain Private and the issue be resolved between the parties in Private communication.

Had the basis for PM's been respected, hate mail or password violations the issue could have been resolved amicably without your attempt to publicly embarrass someone without having first fully understanding the circumstances.

There was some sick individual out there posting garbage using Roamer's name. I just wanted to let the Buggars know what kind of stuff we all are continuing to get.

Back up HC, in hind sight you can say this. In the original post you simply labeled Roamer without explaining anything. You judged him guilty.

If it had been handled via PM between Roamer and RBG, the recipient of the PM, none of this would have transpired.

But appaerenty as I have said PM's are not PM's at FS.

The post was not about 7, but about the lack of respect for people. Which was shown to 7 during her time at the FS and is now being directed at another person. It was sidetracked.

I had a reply to this issue that was deleted where you implied people laughed at Seven and no one defended her.

You clearly did refer to Seven with a comment warranting a reply. A Hot Button issue, if you will, for me.

I took it that you referred to Feltans derogatory post that was included sexually derogatory commentary. Done with Feltan's unique sense of humor but utterly disrespectful of an individual, let alone a member of FS

I replied that I did publicly protest the post in the Forums and in PM's to Feltan. I can't speak for others but please do not imply no one defended her.

I also know Woundy took exception to the post. Others can speak for themselves.

I told Feltan in PM's that the post reflected badly on his character and did not reflect the religious values he says he embraces or the values of FS.

To Feltan's credit he did apologize.

Now tell me did you find fault with that post or were you one of those who laughed? If you did shame on you. If you did nothing shame on you too.

Had the same commentary been made about a female member of your family I have little doubt you would have gone to war.

Can you tell me why no Council member or Moderator did not remove the post? I can, because Feltan was in the clique, friendship overruled respect. Part of the big problems that existed at FS.

BTW HC, if you don't remember the post I think Seven may have a copy.

I also assure you if a sarcastic post were to be made on the topic of RBG's sexual preferences it would be removed immediately.

BTW, for clarity, the post about Seven was not about sexual preferences......don't want any false assumptions here.

And last, can you tell me why you are posting a PM sent to RBG and not RBG posting the PM??

I do hope you don't do lap dances for her also

I hate to tell you HC, but I sincerely think you are being disrespected by MW and RBG, you have my sympathy because, to this day, I feel your personal intentions are good.

[[FS] Hardcase]

Once again,

The alleged PM was shared by Rainbow last night, with a signed email. I consider that being informed. I do not know when Roamer contacted her. As far as I know, the posting of it on the server might have been the first time he knew someone had hijacked his email address. There was no mention of it made until Roamer contacted me and that was after the post. I was informed both times by PM.  Why should I doubt one and not the other.  I consider being informed by both and responded likewise.

Rainbow said she was not going to lower herself to respond to it. I told her something had to be done. I said to myself, all of last night and during the ride to work today, that that sort of thing should not be going on in a gaming community. Therefore, I shared it. How was I to know that some jerk had hijacked his name and password. When I did find out, I shared that also. Not just posting the negative, but also the positive.

I have also noticed your posting on this subject has not as much to do about the people involved, but more about the priciples involved. Sometimes, I think the principles become the main concern (for the greater good they say) and the thoughts and feelings of people are forgotten.

My concern has been people and always people. First I am a puppet, then I am being used, then a Company Man, and now I am being disrepected. I don't think standing up for people is being any of those.

As far as 7 and I are concerned, that is between her and I. If she wants to share, fine.

FS Hardcase

[|BUG| Shamu]

I have also noticed your posting on this subject has not as much to do about the people involved, but more about the priciples involved. Sometimes, I think the principles become the main concern (for the greater good they say) and the thoughts and feelings of people are forgotten.

FS Hardcase

This is actually an interesting observation and one on which me might find some agreement, but for different reasons.

I do depend on principle, often ahead of friendship and personal relationships because it eliminates biased judgement.

At FS when I objected to the punishments handed out I never defended the individuals who were punished. Not enough was known for me to do so. I objected to the solely to the process. I stand by that today.

I do think blind friendship, or personal concern, within Council, had people supporting an act of discipline that was completely unfair to the members.

When the majority of the members objected a stone wall was put up to protect those responsible for the actions. Personal relationships built that wall, not good and honest principles.

I did not know enough to argue for or against the individuals but did know the process in which it was handled was proceduraly unfair and personally biased.

Friendships can be nice, but when they become a clique and cloud fair and honest judgement, based on principles, that friendship has gone to far in a member based organization.

To let friendship dictate over principle and respect of other members is wrong. I think that happened at FS.

So I will stick with principle regardless of my friendships when working within organizations such as we have here.

Just ask Roamer, I consider him a friend but did not hesitate to call into question the deletion of your original post. That's principle. Also an issue resolved to everyones satisfaction.

Having good principles might cause you some hurt, often put you in difficult circumstance but usually provides a morally clear path. It builds character.

Following friends, or decisions based on personal relationships, at the expense of principles could result in biased and unfair actions. Heck, I'm sure your Momma told you not to always follow your friends, use the good sense and principles she taught you.

I do believe some of that is at the very core of FS and the root cause of some of their problems. They follow friends and not fair and honest principles.

[|BUG| Medic]

 Hardcase.... the fact that the core of what was the FS, what everyone calls the "old FS", are resentful... why wouldn't we be. The first 8 became 10, then a dozen, maybe a few more... started setting up the structure, the rules, the values. Let more people in that shared some of those values... until the core became the minority...then like a hostile corporate takeover, woke up one morning and nothing was the same, we felt no longer respected, no longer wanted or needed. When we had two cents, it wasn't two cents anyone else cared about, they had two of their own. You want respect for the new FS... I say wish in one hand...shit in the other. Go find your own place to grow with your own two hands and let someone in to your place and slowly squeeze you out of and then demand respect from you...

I'm not angry with you, just don't wish for something until you understand where the frustration comes form. And if you can't or won't understand.... then don't expect anything.